Could be worse; Selkie could have done a celebratory screech.
Panel 2's original dialogue was funnier to me, but made no sense in context: "Dads, permissions to unleash Hells?" "Nei Li Selkie Smith, there will be no unleashing Hell."
Could be worse; Selkie could have done a celebratory screech.
Andi had best fear facing Todds parents. I get the impression from the way they advocated him answering her calls, that they were supportive of Andi in the past. Now to be exposed as a liar of biblical proportions could kill any live they’d ever had for Andi. I think Andi craves any kind of love, but the supportive, inclusive, nurturing kind provided by Todds folks has got to feel like a euphoric.
.. Andi, you were in a relationship with Todd for *years*.
I’m not sure why you imagined for even a moment his parents wouldn’t be involved in this.
… Unless you had some kind of wild fantasy about how sharing the explanation between the two of you to Amanda and Selkie would be another opportunity to try to restart your relationship, but even now I doubt you’d be *that* stupid…
I wouldn’t be so sure. I mean, she tried to make a move right after dropping the “I lied about the kid being dead for eight years” bomb. Plus she reclaimed Amanda with the intent of getting back together with Todd.
Not to say that she does not genuinely love and care for Amanda. But her original intention (and still was part of her reason for taking Amanda back as made obvious by what happened at the Aquarium) was for getting Todd back.
That doesn’t make sense. She actively avoided Todd when she got Amanda back.
No, she was actively avoiding telling anybody the truth.
She was trying to pick her spot. Yes, she avoided him when she was in a sticky place where she might have to cop to her fault but once she got it out there, she tried getting back with Todd romantically. So at least part of her did want to use the situation to get Todd back.
I suspect she was thinking “Okay, we’ll talk about it all as a group, and from there we can figure out how to explain things to the rest of the family.” (I’ve got to admit, I didn’t realize until now his parents were invited to this same first meeting.)
I also suspect she’s been deliberately not-thinking about how his parents were going to react to finding out the truth, because logically you can’t avoid that one forever but anxiety means yeah maybe so but that doesn’t mean you’re not going to try because even a few minutes in the future feels like an eternity when you’re living second to second. And I suspect Andi’s been living like that for YEARS now. (And it is very very much not fun.)
“I’ve got to admit, I didn’t realize until now his parents were invited to this same first meeting.”
I feel, once told of the situation, you’d need a zombie apocalypse to keep them from being present at the get-together. Possibly not even that would stop them.
They’d be running through the streets with guns and swords to get there.
I suspect that would only make them more determined to get to and protect the child they were denied all these years.
And this, THIS is the hell Andi was not prepared for.
Honestly I’m impressed she’s managed to go on this long without her skeletal structure liquefying from the pressure. It will be a very inconvenient plot twist if Amanda just now gets her mom back only to have her melt and she’ll have to live with Selkie of all people.
(Those two are not going to have a functional sibling relationship for at least a few years, people. The resentment that was there even before this goes too deep to be resolved without some serious intervention, and now… oh dear.)
Oh, Andi. Andi Andi Andi. And you know the first words out of their mouths are going to be “And you didn’t ask us for help? WHY?!” And she’s not really going to have an answer, because that’s how anxiety works.
The tragedy here really is that this could have been solved in much the same way but with far less pain and deceit if Andi had just been able to talk about her concerns in a neutral environment before going into labor. If there had been a parents’ meeting. ANYTHING.
Sibling relationships are diverse… Depends on what you define as “functioning”
Dunno about Regalli, but my definition of “functioning sibling relationship” is:
-their fights don’t blow into all-out battles more than once every other month
-they present a unified front to any hostility from outside the family, excepting their closest friends
-they have moments where they express genuine affection for each other at least as often as they have full-out battles
That last one will probably take the longest.
In this case I’m thinking “Not actively hating each other” as the barest of bare minimums. Which is pretty firmly where Amanda and Selkie are right now, given the last comic had Amanda going “AWESOME she’s in serious trouble I’m gonna gloat!” and Selkie is now going “AWESOME she’s in serious trouble I’m gonna gloat!”
I mean, Amanda spent the past five years or so bullying Selkie, Selkie spent that time hating and resenting Amanda and is now trying to rub her face in it as much as possible, and I would not be surprised if they actually try to seriously hurt each other before this arc is through.
(I know sibling relationships can come in many forms. My dad and his next-eldest sister have a functional relationship, and she once threatened to call the police on him and told him he should have stayed in the army on a base several states away during one of their fights when they were both in college. Selkie and Amanda are not even at that level, because that would imply that there’s ever a point where they feel anything for each other beyond masked hostility and VERY RARELY pity.)
You are vastly overestimating Selkie’s vindictiveness.
Bear in mind that the situations are not even remotely equal. Amanda has been a complete and utter jerk to Selkie for as long as they’ve been in the orphanage, to the point where when she had nightmares, the monsters that threw her into the abyss *looked like Amanda and her little clique*.
When she was adopted, she rubbed Amanda’s face in it *exactly once* when she said goodbye, then moved on with her life.
For Amanda, on the other hand, that was the turning point where Selkie graduated from “Fishie freak that nobody likes so I can have fun tormenting her” to “Fishy freak that TOOK WHAT WAS RIGHTFULLY MINE AND DARES TO DEFY ME” and pretty much stepped up her campaign of bullying whenever she could.
And again, here, we’ve had Amanda pouncing on the *possibility* that Selkie might be in trouble and insisting to hear all the juicy details so she can torment Selkie with them (and implying that she has a right to demand those details from Todd, which… gets really bad the more you think about it).
When her eagerness and namecalling gets her into trouble with *her* mother, however, Selkie sees it for what it is: a long overdue correction of a wrong that Amanda has been perpetrating toward her — Justice, in other words. She also asks her father for permission to do a gloating supervillain laugh, and doesn’t complain when he says no.
Given she called the police on Truck and was gloating there too, I’m thinking Selkie has a bit of a vindictive streak. It’s justified, yes, but don’t forget the trip to the aquarium and how she chose her outfit for that largely for the purpose of going “I’m happier than you, I’m better than you”.
Seriously, my sympathy goes more to Selkie than Amanda, any day, but she is holding a very heavy grudge right now and that’s not going to change until this family gets some serious help.
You’re aware that Truck nearly *killed* her, aren’t you? Yeah, sure, that may not have been his intent but that’s what happened.
As for the aquarium, Amanda deliberately threw down the gauntlet the day before.
All right, I have to give Andi credit in frame 1, putting an instant stop to the name calling. If I’m going to criticize her when she does bad, I’ll give her credit when she does good and that speed deserves credit.
However, Andi should have known it would go this direction. This is a matter of family and of course Todd is turning to his family. They need in on this as it affects them as well. They could have had a granddaughter all these years.
Since Todd has broken the news to his parents already, they’ll be past the first shock. Their kindness and common sense will have had a chance to kick in, and they will now be thinking mostly about what’s best for their new-found granddaughter Amanda. (And Todd. And Selkie. And maybe even Andi, who for Amanda’s sake surely needs some advice and guidance right now that she’s not getting from her own mother.)
One bit of wisdom many older folks have learned the hard way is that real life doesn’t come with an Undo button. What’s done is done. Recriminations are a waste of time and emotional energy. The best thing you can do is focus on what to do NOW.
that all depends of exactly WHAT he told them this meeting was about… if he just told them that he and Andi needed to talk about “Stuff” with them, they may think that it’s about him and her getting back together… but if he let the Bomb drop, then they may break speed laws getting to wherever they’ll be having this confab… and may even be ready to break bones too… i totally understand her reluctance to get his parents involved, especially not knowing what he’s told them so far… however, it still NEEDS to be done. the amount of pain and suffering needs to end, and the quicker its done the better, just like ripping a band-aid off, you can do it slow or fast, fast may hurt more, but it’ll last a lot shorter time than the slow-rip one does…
I really, really hope he told them the whole thing. It’s way too cruel and unfair and dysfunctional otherwise
Think he did, this seems to be painted as a contrast between the two. Andi kept lying to them for ages, Todd told them everything right away.
I wonder if they’ll be as hard on Andi as some think (including myself, in past posts). I just realized that for as long as Todd & Andi were together back then, the two sets of parents have to know each other. Their perception of Andi’s mother may be enlightening.
Not that this excuses Andi’s actions at all. But they may not be primarily angry at Andi over this.
Maybe they’ll understand that she was doing what she thought was best for her daughter.
The more I think about it, there was a certain logic to what Andi did. Todd and her were just teenagers when she got pregnant and would barely be able to take care of a baby. Their parents probably wouldn’t be able to support them that much either since Todd’s parents were raising two other children at the time and Andi’s mom is a single mother.
Having to raise a baby would probably mean putting off college which would lead to low-paying jobs and maybe a bad home life due to stress (Andi would have assumed this since it seemed to happen to her own family and her mother was influencing her decision).
Based on how Todd was acting about the idea of being a father, Andi thought he would never allow the baby to be put up for adoption. So, he would either raise the child by himself leading to the same problems mentioned above or she would be stuck in a relationship that would turn bad fast.
She did what she thought would be best for everyone with Todd and herself in a stable, safe, and happy relationship and Amanda being adopted by a foster family that could provide a better life for her. It was kind of an ends justify the means thing.
Seriously, I’m pretty certain their anger’s going to all be directed at the fact that if she had just TOLD THEM she was thinking about adoption, they could have avoided so much grief! And when they ask why she didn’t, her answer’s probably going to be something along the lines of “Todd was so excited, and so I swallowed things until he wasn’t there” but I think also a fair bit of “I don’t know, I really wasn’t.” The Labor Lie really seems to strike me as an impulsive jump at being offered a way out (One I’m not sure but willing to be proved otherwise was never really offered as an option until she was, again, IN LABOR,) and the subsequent lie as a panicked realization that yes there are consequences.
i wonder how amanda’s going to react to suddenly having an extended family. it’s pretty much a given that they will react warmly to her, but will she take it well or get defensive and/or hostile?
If Andi tells them in advance and in private that Amanda is like a wounded animal when it comes things like that and She’s not the hugging type .
She’ll be guarded at first but willing to hug later. I have the feeling that Amanda’s brattyness will kick in though.
They’ve done this before. Todd was a wounded creature when they adopted him.
Do we know that for sure?
from his own recollection from when he was deciding to pick Selkie as his daughter. that was NOT a “happy” kid in his memory.
She hugged Andi right away when they met and based on panel 4 she seems to not hate Todd anymore so I don’t see why she wouldn’t react warmly to more family.
They’ll certainly start out warm and accepting, but that’s going to cool off pretty quick when it becomes obvious that she’s a bully and a brat and can’t stand Selkie.
At the very *least* she can expect a patient but firm lecture on Why This Is Not Okay, Young Lady. At worst, depending on how loudly she’ll attempt to put her foot down, well…
I can totally see that happening , and I agree that it would stick eventually if Andi also has a talk with her to have it stick .
Andi knows deep down in her heart that Amanda needs to meet Todd’s parents since her own mother has rejected her; even that the cost of her own discomfort.
And suddenly I’m wondering where Todd’s parents were during the drama 10 years ago. Todd was happy and sappy enough about having a kid you’d think he’d have told them (unless he didn’t want to until he’d become a manager and could present his parents with how well he was doing, but honestly, even though he was a punk and therefore, presumably, rebellious, having met his parents, how credible is that? [I am aware that was a convoluted sentence]), and that they would have offered all support imaginable. So unless they never offered it to Andi in person, which is… credible, but seems unlikely, and though a scared teenage girl is much more likely to listen to her mother than to her boyfriend’s parents…
Hmm. Interesting.
I’m also wondering how much guilt over giving Amanda up bled into the harshness of her comment to Todd about adopting being cheating, or whatever it was, but that’s an entirely different matter.
It’s implied Mari and Theo were around, since the urn is on their mantel. Andi’s choices were more likely influenced by her own mother’s insistence that the baby be given up mixed with a fear that maybe Todd’s parents didn’t REALLY mean they’d be supportive, since Andi kept being reminded what a big responsibility babies are by her own mother which means that Todd’s folks can’t possibly mean they’d be so helpful no matter what he or they say so…*insert frightened teenage thoughts for multiple pages here*
Andi said adoption was like babysitting. I’ve taken that to indicate that on some level, she was expecting her Happily Ever After with Todd to include leveling about Amanda Marie, going to claim their daughter as a couple, and not having to worry about it ever again. After all, they have their daughter now, don’t they? And they’re in a position to give her a good life, so it’s all good! Those thoughts are understandable in a scared 17 year old and never had much to challenge them, but are being exposed to reality now.
Yeah, I suspect they were there and would have been happy to help, and in fact would probably have been just as happy to have a long conversation about her fears and what she thought was best for them and the baby had she initiated it. Like I said, that’s the tragedy here, that it COULD have gone much the same without Andi lying, but her anxieties and Todd’s enthusiasm and the parents not deciding to arrange The Talk That Needed To Happen to get everyone on the same page (At least themselves, if they didn’t realize Andi was freaked out,) all mean we got the worst of all possible conclusions there.
I will say I feel for Andi here. She was clearly expecting just the four of them, not just the four of them + grandparents. Taking a step back and thinking about it, yeah, it’s obvious Todd’s parents would insist on coming even if Todd told them to stay away (and I REALLY don’t see that happening), but we’ve already had long discussions about Andi’s relationship with her own mother and how that probably affects how she sees Todd’s relationship with his parents. Andi had to worry about Amanda and just plain didn’t have the mental energy to dedicate to thinking about Todd’s parents.
Besides, we know how Andi’s version of that conversation went – “I could use some support, Mom.” “No.” (Please note, this is an oversimplified version, I do realize Patricia had more to say and brought up legit concerns.) Why would she expect Mari and Theo to be much different?
…And I am getting SUCH amusing mental images of Mari and Theo arriving with a “You should be ashamed of yourself, Andi! Now where’s our other granddaughter, we’ve got some spoilin’ to catch up on!” As unlikely and potentially damaging as that situation would be, I know it’s highly unlikely to play out in any way like I’m picturing, but I keep getting giggle-worthy visions, anyway…
Hm, should be interesting when Amanda attempts to lord her ‘authenticity’ as Todd’s biological offspring over Selkie only to discover that Todd was adopted as well and her new grandparents will have absolutely zero patience with any kind of suggestion or implication that Selkie is somehow less family than Amanda is…
OMG– THIS!!
Oh, the Humility! Humanity? Comedy? … Whatevs.
I’m hoping she rejects them because of that.
I hope Andi gets torn into by both of them for this. She’d deserve it.
I agree but not at this meeting this should be about the kids and any negative conversations should be done later.. Or behind locked doors with someone supervising the kids several rooms away.
Look at that nosy person listening through the door.
I was NOTICING the eavesdropping shadow! Who is also on the tags for this page. Heh!
and i wonder what Mina will think about this exchange?, she is after all, standing RIGHT THERE on the other side of that door…
so to paraphrase…
Selkie: “Dads, permissions to unleash Hells?”
Todd: “No I’ve got it covered. I’m calling in your grandparents.”
Maybe Selkie could unleash Hecks instead.
No, Selki, you may Not pull the lever to release the Kracken.
I really love how everyone comments in such a way it seems Andi and Todd are real and can read what they say. I think it shows just how good of a job you do with this comic to stir so many real feelings up in people. 😀 Great work!
Hooo boy. This could go either way. We’re could be in for a rough ride, or Andi could be in for a surprise, in the form of getting support from Todd’s parents.
I gotta say this is slightly unfair. He could have told her in advance his parents were coming so she could invite hers if she felt like it. Because this honestly just could be perceived as an attack oh Andi from all sides with absolutely no one there to be her support. Not that HER mom would be much support. I really hope they don’t all just lay into her, because that would be so very wrong.
When my boyfriend and I broke up he called his MOM before telling me we were breaking up, then put her on the phone so she could tell me how terrible a person I was and then his dad before I had any idea what was going on. Do you know how that feels? Really bad. It makes you feel as if you’ve done something horrible even if you haven’t, because you’ve got no defense for yourself, completely blindsided.
Now, Andi HAS done wrong so it’s a different situation, but I can definitely feel the fear she feels right now. It’s not a nice feeling at all. I really believe Todd and her should have had a conversation alone somewhere and then at a different time, get his parents involved. Because his parents definitely deserved to be involved, that’s obvious, but you can’t just make Andi feel boxed in like that.
When my boyfriend essentially got his mother to break up with me for him, I was absolutely furious. Here were are, both 20 something adults who should be dealing with our problems together and he has his mom do it for him? It made me feel like crap. Like he never once truly cared for me at all. After that his mother instructed me I was being kicked out of our house. The one I helped pay for and that I wasn’t allowed to have any of my stuff. Luckily his dad said that was being completely unreasonable and talked some sense into her and him.
Now, I doubt Todd is going to let his parents do everything for him, but I can still see how upsetting the situation is. On a side note, my ex boyfriends mother was VERY similar to how I assume Andi’s mother was. Controlling, decided everything for him, he never did anything without consulting her. I blame him a little bit for his actions, but I blame his mother more than anything. She had been manipulating him ever since he was a child. She was a heavy drinker and often cried to him about how terrible her life was and how he was her only salvation, she put it in his mind she always needed him and he could never leave her.
And it destroyed our relationship. I can only imagine how daunting time with his mother was for him. He confided in me once that he hated when she got drunk and started crying and saying terrible things, but that he didn’t know what else to do but be there for her. I never realized how deep the abuse ran. I knew he had tremendous issues with his dad, but I had no idea the problems he had with his mother until it was too late.
So while I don’t think what Andi did was right, I can hold a little sympathy for her. Abuse from a parent is hard. Very hard. Abuse from a person you love makes you very blind to right and wrong. Some people can never recover or be ‘normal’ for it. It truly is a horrible thing.
And sadly, people who aren’t directly involved tend to be hurt the most…
I love Selkie. Many kids her age would just do the super villain laugh and then get scolded in the process. I love how she asks permission first, it’s adorable.
Yeah, Selkie is absolutely amazing!
It also roundabout worked to rub it in Amanda’s face more. She can say stuff like that and get turned down gently. Considering Amanda’s prior situation, she would have been yelled at for it most probably. Selkie probably didn’t mean it that way, but it’s far crueler to do it that way than just laughing.
YAAAY! Indeed. 🙂 Hahahaha. Suffer, Andi, suffer. You reap what you sow. XD
She’s a kid… Kids don’t always have to make sense. Save that one for later!
Andi is about to get destroyed.
Popcorn, anyone?
Don’t mind if I do. *takes some popcorn*
And I brought sodas, let this well deserved hell play out! I have never been so impatient for another page.
Theo, please continue to be the amazing voice of parenting wisdom you’ve been this entire comic, because dear lord, if there’s ever been a child who needs someone to man up and eat the eyeballs it’s Amanda…
Yes, please let all venom towards Andi be done in private and focus on what is best for the kids
True. This meeting is for Amanda, not to punish Andi. Amanda needs this. She needs to meet her support base and that she doesn’t need the rage. I still suspect all of this anger on Amanda is still defensive mechanisms. It will take a while to get used to this. Amanda will be angry and Hulk out many times before she can get better. So this is needed to take away some of that anger.
Sure she could eat the eyeballs, but she would have to fight Selkie for them.
Oh,I never ask permission for my super villain laugh. That’s kind of the point.
A lot of guys ignore the laugh and that’s about standards. I mean, if you’re gonna get into the Evil League of Evil, you have to have a memorable laugh. What, do you think Bad Horse didn’t work on his whinny? His terrible death-whinny?
I’ve been thinking about this a while and now that I know how to word it, I’m going to say it.
I AT LEAST hope that IF Andi does FOR SOME REASON get ganged up on by Todd and his parents (I’m not sure how close she was with them, but enough to at least have them be sympathetic when she kept calling him over and over again but he wouldn’t answer WAY earlier on in the comic) THAT:
1: She stands up for herself. YES, what she did was awful, but she was 17/18, scared, in labor, Todd wasn’t there and her mother convinced her it was best.
And 2: That she make it clear that, by the looks of it, NOBODY considered her feelings about having a baby, or even BEING PREGNANT when she WAS!!!
I swear, it ASTOUNDS ME. So many people think a pregnant woman is a ROCK. But how can you be a rock when you’re THAT YOUNG? Back tracking to her talk with her mother, she opened up to her that she didn’t want to be pregnant. So somewhere along the line, she was probably going to discuss ‘options’ with Todd (the two ‘A’ words: abortion and adoption) but when he came around to the idea of being a dad, it probably crushed her and she couldn’t bring herself to talk about them anymore.
At the end of the day, I really feel bad for her. Sure, we don’t know right now what she wanted to do when she first found out, or if she even could explore those options. Her mother seems set in her ways, so maybe she basically forbade her from having an abortion, if it was even an option to begin with. (Some religious people are VERY pro-life and throw around the word ‘adoption’ like seed at birds in the park)
I know it’s kind of heavy territory, but Patricia did say she thought them keeping the baby would have ‘ruined their lives’ because they wouldn’t have been able to go to college and get good jobs instead of unsteady ones that they would need to juggle in order to raise little Amanda Marie. They were teenagers. Not exactly stable (no offense to my eldest brother who was born when our dad was a teenager).
Am I saying Andi should be forgiven with the wave of a magic wand? Absolutely not. But look at it from her perspective. If you were in her situation, feeling as powerless as she did. That’s how I see why she did what she did.
That’s my stance, at least. Maybe reread her conversation with her mom and you’ll at least see why I do:
https://selkiecomic.com/comic/selkie586/
https://selkiecomic.com/comic/selkie587/
https://selkiecomic.com/comic/selkie588/
https://selkiecomic.com/comic/selkie589/
https://selkiecomic.com/comic/selkie590/
(P.S.: There are some other points to my argument, but I’m pretty sure I’ve mentioned them time and time again in other comments on other strips so I don’t quite feel like repeating myself. ^^”’ )
Yeah, what she did was a terrible, terrible choice but she was panicked and IN LABOR and no one seems to have given her an outlet to voice her concerns earlier.
And that lie was horrible, but once she had made it she was pretty well stuck with it. There was no way she could come clean without, you know, Todd dumping her. And I think, for all of Andi’s terrible decision-making and problem-solving, that she knew that. Almost every mistake she’s made in this series stems back to her being UTTERLY TERRIFIED. I have trouble utterly condemning her for that.
I don’t think she’ll stand up for herself since she seems to have a submissive personality.
I’ll also take a stand in the unfair camp. If two people set up a meeting to ‘discuss things’, for one side to bring unannounced ‘reinforcements’ is just wrong. If I know I can’t face the situation alone, or don’t want to, that’s fine, but I should say so up front. Andi should reschedule.
I’m hoping what happens is they come and take Amanda and Selkie aside, getting to know Amanda and letting Todd and Andi talk it out. Which would really be the best option available. If that is what happens, then it is the exact opposite of unfair and makes things go a direction not possible otherwise.
In general that’s true. I suspect Todd wasn’t thinking ONE BIT about how having them there would feel to Andi. Or if he was, he was still too angry at her to care.
All the same, given what we’ve seen of Todd’s parents, I think it isn’t going to turn out as badly as she fears. If anything, they’ll be a calming influence.
Dick move Todd.
Oh, Andi. Did you think this was going to be…a date? Or that you could somehow magically turn it into one?
That’s exactly what you thought, isn’t it. A charming family outing, the happily reunited couple and their two adorable little girls, loving siblings skipping hand in hand, loving grown-ups ditto.
Instead, Todd has included his parents in the family conference that they should have been included in eight years ago. It isn’t a matter of anybody ganging up on anybody else; it’s a matter of rightful inclusion in a decision-making process.
You are at liberty to invite your mother, and let her make the case for why she advised you as she did.
Of course, if Todd’s parents had been included eight years ago, none of this would be necessary now. Matters would have turned out very differently; because any adoption agency would have taken one look at their track record in the kid department and cheerfully handed Amanda over to them, with a big collective sigh of relief. Possibly some hesitation over their age; but they would have soon bulldozed that flat. The child would have been in your and Todd’s lives all along, without damaging your educations or careers.
Like Andi would invite the same mother that insisted on Andi telling the lie and was against the adoption and wanted nothing to do with Amanda and Andi decided to exclude her out Amanda’s life .
It would be a shock to see her mom visit out of the blue.
Yes, I had my tongue shoved so far into my cheek while typing the fourth para that it made a permanent ouchie.
Reading this again… Yeah, Todd, I know you’re angry, but that really is a dick move. No matter how much your parents are going to keep you from strangling Andi, and how they’ll be much better over the whole thing that you can possibly (quite justifiably so!) be, and better for Andi, and better for Amanda, and are essentially exactly the people you want to have here… dick move.
That being said, Dave, I am impressed by how much you’re able to get people going. You’re clearly doing something right if you can spark this level of discussion on basically every installment you post.
Be prepared to duck the vengeful fist of A GRANDMOTHER DENIED!!!
Wait is the teacher listening in?