Reminds me of an event that happened to me… I am betting most parents go through a moment like this.
My sister wanted to visit my new daughter and be an aunt, I was fine with that but said she had to do some things beforehand for safety. She got upset and my father found out, he wanted to be protective papa and thought I was bullying/being unfair to my sister and confronted me. He quickly realized I was being protective papa too and that he was on the wrong side of this argument. From there I think he also realized that I wasn’t just his son anymore but I was a father too and he had to recatagorize how he thought of me.
A good example of a parent making the realization that though their child will always be their child, they are no longer “a” child. It’s a difficult transition to make and not all parents complete it.
I think Todd and Mari can reach a new and better equilibrium, but the initial setting of boundaries is stressful. Todd’s Dad Mode is in good form, for sure.
Not to souynd wishy-washy here, since I was all about “Grandma is screwing up”… She WAS raised in a very different time. And believe it or not, kids used to be told that things we did were bad, horrible, etc. and we somehow KNEW they were talking about actions. Now, this is from the context of a FUNCTIONAL family, where parents love their kids, etc. so, you can stop all the cherrypicking before it starts. I am not condoning or trying to be an advocate for no improvement in family dynamics. I am only saying that while Grandma was edging towards and did cross an extreme one way, Todd needs to be careful to not knee-jerk his way into going the OTHER extreme. Grandma is in the wrong here, but the kids aren’t going to suddenly lose their sense of self-worth by what she said. Her past actions are far too loving for them to believe that. Her wrong is in her attitude towards their powers, not her choice of words. Everyone says the wrong thing now and again. Cancel Culture tends to refuse to acknowledge that fact. That’s why that Olympic Official had to step down because he admitted to being a bully when he was a CHILD, for god’s sake. How dipsh*tty is that?
*You knew they were talking about actions. That’s definitely not universally true. And it’s unlikely to be true for two traumatized girls with major disrupted attachment. They are likely to take it as a personal indictment of them. Maybe they won’t, especially getting to see a glimpse of Todd’s reaction, but Mari really needs to be careful with both her attitude towards her powers and how she says it.
I am not meaning to suggest that she is irredeemable. I do not think anyone has said that, except maybe “Sophie the Giraffe”, who claimed on the last comic to have “never liked Mari” (frankly, I can’t remember her last appearance well enough to have an opinion about her one way or another). However, just because she is not the single worst human being who ever lived does not excuse her flaws.
Certainly, she might later realize she was being unreasonable and change her tune. People do that. However, the possibility that she might eventually stop being wrong does not change the fact that, right now, she is wrong.
Whether Todd ends up going too far and saying anything unreasonable in this conversation has yet to be seen. So far, he hasn’t.
I strongly disagree. She definitely called their INNATE Echo abilities “that horrid stuff” and told them not to do it any more.
That’s on par with telling a trans person who’s trying to learn who they are and express themselves to “not do that horrid stuff any more” in reference to their presentation and transition.
Yeah no, that’s a ridiculous assertion. Don’t try to equate super-powers with someone discovering their gender identity, it’s problematic and distinctly unhelpful.
In most cases I’d agree with you, except one of them is a different species who’s societal members have flat out Told her they find extreme value in this ability. “So if the thing I do that my species values is horrid, does that mean they are? and by extension I am?” This is the kind of self doubt I and many other children have dealt with in the past and we only grew up with Normal bullying and shots at our self esteem. Now Selkie seems to have a lot of self confidence but honestly I still can’t tell if it’s a mask and show to hide insecurity or she’s really that confident.
Hooo boy, Angry Mom voice is one thing but when Pissed and Protective Dad voice comes out…seldom used but when it makes an appearance s**t just got real.
Honestly, my issue with Mari is her feelings or thoughts about echo abilities. She really hasn’t had that much exposure or information on the subject, so being very scared is quite normal. It is bypassing Todd and Andi to have an alone talk with the kids before she has time to process or get used to anything. I could understand asking if the kids are okay, but I think that she should have just left it at that and just asked the parents to have the discussion with the kids about not doing it around grandma (at least until she has time to adjust). Even if this conversation with the grandkids went perfectly, she is still stepping on the actual parents’ toes with creating rules of what the kids can do outside of her home. It wasn’t even as if Todd and Andi weren’t there and therefore couldn’t be a part of the conversation. They were there, and having this conversation without them when she could have included everyone, especially to help make sure that rules get enforced or for background information that the kids might not know that the parents do. It makes me wonder if she subconsciously knew that what she was going to say wouldn’t fly, so sought to do it while everyone was distracted.
With all thoughts about what not to do, I am really not sure what should be done in this case. Would immediately getting her more information and good experiences relating to this be the better choice or just giving her some time? I don’t want her fears to fester or blow out of proportion, but pushing her too far when she is scared would be bad too. How do you point out the line that she crossed without making her too defensive? I really don’t know how rationally she is thinking right now, and while this might be her current honest thoughts, that could change. Would she regret what she said after a night’s sleep or would it solidify in self righteousness?
Then she should have talked too Todd about it before telling her grand-daughters that is “horrid”. And you also need to remember that echos are a very important part of Selkie’s culture and it’s one of the few things that connect her to that and her mother. Mari needed to be way more careful about what she said.
She doesn’t understand them, but that doesn’t mean that they aren’t understandable. Yet she’s shown no interest in even trying to understand them, and immediately jumps to making the worst possible assumptions.
You don’t get to use ignorance as an excuse when it results from deliberate closedmindedness.
So while I agree with all the criticism people have been giving Mari over her calling the echo powers horrid, one thing I have notice is no one is talking about is how important being an echo is in Selkie’s culture and how it is one of the few things she has that connect her too that and her mother. What Mari did is tell a child that an aspect of her culture and society, a very important aspect that has ton of practical as well spiritual uses, is wrong and bad. And that maybe the most harmful thing she could do.
Okay guys look, these are little girls who suddenly got the ability SHOOT GREEN FIRE OUT OF THEIR EYEBALLS. And just admitted that it hurt/scared them at the beginning.
“It’s Selkie’s Culture” etc yatta yatta yatta guys it’s FIRE OUT OF HER EYEBALLS. There’s not a single culture IRL whose Thing is to SHOOT FIRE OUT OF THEIR EYEBALLS. You guys imagine your 8 year old niece suddenly developping that ability (and burning holes in her bedroom walls) and tell me with a straight face that you’ll succeed in being PC about it.
Cut the grandma some slack, it’s not like she’s been slooooowly introduced to the concept of echoes in several years (by reading 3 pages a week). How much time has passed since the girls’ ability manifested? Is it 2 months? A month? And how many times has she witnessed it herself? Every day, like the girls’ parents who enter the bedrooms to find a new burn marj on the wall?
I am probably the only one here who thinks that Grandma is entirely entitled to describe something the kids are doing that damages the house as being horrid, and that she is entitled to ask them not to do it at her house.
I trust Dave, and Todd, so I think this is going to be fine, but I do not trust people who come down Mama Bear or Papa Bear to not be being bullies using defense of their children as justification to use anger to throw their weight around. I only ever have seen entitled people doing it so for me it is highly suspect behaviour.
Professor Trenchbull enabling his son comes to mind.
I am not comfortable with Todd reacting with rage BEFORE he figures out what was being said and what was meant, especially where his mother is showing a fear reaction to him. This is not going to make Grandma less scared about what the kids are doing, but it might make her afraid of the kids themselves.
On the other hand I can easily believe that Todd has a short fuse right now from being called out for being insufficiently protective of his kids.
…Personally speaking, while I know grandma’s in the wrong here- and I think him being Kinda Mad ain’t anything out of his purview- but I just keep wondering how much his parents must have had to stay Really Aware of being trans-racial adoption parents. How quick any single misstep could have been used to take their kids away from them.
I think the conversation hasn’t even started; so I ain’t making any assumptions about How Bad Either Person is being here, otherwise.
He’s going Full Protective Dad. Good on him. You can’t contextualize calling children horrid for what they are
someone’s got some explaining to do.
From that shrunken posture, she knows she Done Screwed Up.
Papa Wolf Mode ACTIVATED.
+15 Strength
+20 Constitution
+50 Intimidate
Oh hey big T, didn’t know you were also an echo. Got the colored voice down pat, now grandma is going to help you with the flaming eyes.
That’s just the Sergeant Dad voice.
Like Mina’s Commander Mom/Teacher voice, but milder.
Top tier power move Todd. You get an extra 15 points to your Dad score.
My favorite part is Selkie’s line in panel 2. She can tell what’s about to happen 🙂
Whoops. Yea, it does seem to be an innate part of them; pretty awful calling that “horrid”.
Did she never see the X-Men? Sheesh.
“Have you tried not being a mutant?”
Reminds me of an event that happened to me… I am betting most parents go through a moment like this.
My sister wanted to visit my new daughter and be an aunt, I was fine with that but said she had to do some things beforehand for safety. She got upset and my father found out, he wanted to be protective papa and thought I was bullying/being unfair to my sister and confronted me. He quickly realized I was being protective papa too and that he was on the wrong side of this argument. From there I think he also realized that I wasn’t just his son anymore but I was a father too and he had to recatagorize how he thought of me.
A good example of a parent making the realization that though their child will always be their child, they are no longer “a” child. It’s a difficult transition to make and not all parents complete it.
I think Todd and Mari can reach a new and better equilibrium, but the initial setting of boundaries is stressful. Todd’s Dad Mode is in good form, for sure.
Not to souynd wishy-washy here, since I was all about “Grandma is screwing up”… She WAS raised in a very different time. And believe it or not, kids used to be told that things we did were bad, horrible, etc. and we somehow KNEW they were talking about actions. Now, this is from the context of a FUNCTIONAL family, where parents love their kids, etc. so, you can stop all the cherrypicking before it starts. I am not condoning or trying to be an advocate for no improvement in family dynamics. I am only saying that while Grandma was edging towards and did cross an extreme one way, Todd needs to be careful to not knee-jerk his way into going the OTHER extreme. Grandma is in the wrong here, but the kids aren’t going to suddenly lose their sense of self-worth by what she said. Her past actions are far too loving for them to believe that. Her wrong is in her attitude towards their powers, not her choice of words. Everyone says the wrong thing now and again. Cancel Culture tends to refuse to acknowledge that fact. That’s why that Olympic Official had to step down because he admitted to being a bully when he was a CHILD, for god’s sake. How dipsh*tty is that?
*You knew they were talking about actions. That’s definitely not universally true. And it’s unlikely to be true for two traumatized girls with major disrupted attachment. They are likely to take it as a personal indictment of them. Maybe they won’t, especially getting to see a glimpse of Todd’s reaction, but Mari really needs to be careful with both her attitude towards her powers and how she says it.
I am not meaning to suggest that she is irredeemable. I do not think anyone has said that, except maybe “Sophie the Giraffe”, who claimed on the last comic to have “never liked Mari” (frankly, I can’t remember her last appearance well enough to have an opinion about her one way or another). However, just because she is not the single worst human being who ever lived does not excuse her flaws.
Certainly, she might later realize she was being unreasonable and change her tune. People do that. However, the possibility that she might eventually stop being wrong does not change the fact that, right now, she is wrong.
Whether Todd ends up going too far and saying anything unreasonable in this conversation has yet to be seen. So far, he hasn’t.
A better analogue here is being uncomfortable with someone who owns a gun bringing it along to your house.
Are the guns part of the body of the person in your scenario? Because they can’t leave their echo powers at home
They can just not do lasers.
I strongly disagree. She definitely called their INNATE Echo abilities “that horrid stuff” and told them not to do it any more.
That’s on par with telling a trans person who’s trying to learn who they are and express themselves to “not do that horrid stuff any more” in reference to their presentation and transition.
Yeah no, that’s a ridiculous assertion. Don’t try to equate super-powers with someone discovering their gender identity, it’s problematic and distinctly unhelpful.
The proper analogy would have been if Amanda didn’t have Echo powers, but insisted on being treated like she’s an Echo anyway.
Could you clarify what you meant by this?
Just for you, m’dear 🖕🖕
In most cases I’d agree with you, except one of them is a different species who’s societal members have flat out Told her they find extreme value in this ability. “So if the thing I do that my species values is horrid, does that mean they are? and by extension I am?” This is the kind of self doubt I and many other children have dealt with in the past and we only grew up with Normal bullying and shots at our self esteem. Now Selkie seems to have a lot of self confidence but honestly I still can’t tell if it’s a mask and show to hide insecurity or she’s really that confident.
Hooo boy, Angry Mom voice is one thing but when Pissed and Protective Dad voice comes out…seldom used but when it makes an appearance s**t just got real.
Honestly, my issue with Mari is her feelings or thoughts about echo abilities. She really hasn’t had that much exposure or information on the subject, so being very scared is quite normal. It is bypassing Todd and Andi to have an alone talk with the kids before she has time to process or get used to anything. I could understand asking if the kids are okay, but I think that she should have just left it at that and just asked the parents to have the discussion with the kids about not doing it around grandma (at least until she has time to adjust). Even if this conversation with the grandkids went perfectly, she is still stepping on the actual parents’ toes with creating rules of what the kids can do outside of her home. It wasn’t even as if Todd and Andi weren’t there and therefore couldn’t be a part of the conversation. They were there, and having this conversation without them when she could have included everyone, especially to help make sure that rules get enforced or for background information that the kids might not know that the parents do. It makes me wonder if she subconsciously knew that what she was going to say wouldn’t fly, so sought to do it while everyone was distracted.
With all thoughts about what not to do, I am really not sure what should be done in this case. Would immediately getting her more information and good experiences relating to this be the better choice or just giving her some time? I don’t want her fears to fester or blow out of proportion, but pushing her too far when she is scared would be bad too. How do you point out the line that she crossed without making her too defensive? I really don’t know how rationally she is thinking right now, and while this might be her current honest thoughts, that could change. Would she regret what she said after a night’s sleep or would it solidify in self righteousness?
good thoughts
Oh give grandma a break. She’s dealing with forces beyond her ken.
Then she should have talked too Todd about it before telling her grand-daughters that is “horrid”. And you also need to remember that echos are a very important part of Selkie’s culture and it’s one of the few things that connect her to that and her mother. Mari needed to be way more careful about what she said.
She doesn’t understand them, but that doesn’t mean that they aren’t understandable. Yet she’s shown no interest in even trying to understand them, and immediately jumps to making the worst possible assumptions.
You don’t get to use ignorance as an excuse when it results from deliberate closedmindedness.
So while I agree with all the criticism people have been giving Mari over her calling the echo powers horrid, one thing I have notice is no one is talking about is how important being an echo is in Selkie’s culture and how it is one of the few things she has that connect her too that and her mother. What Mari did is tell a child that an aspect of her culture and society, a very important aspect that has ton of practical as well spiritual uses, is wrong and bad. And that maybe the most harmful thing she could do.
Okay guys look, these are little girls who suddenly got the ability SHOOT GREEN FIRE OUT OF THEIR EYEBALLS. And just admitted that it hurt/scared them at the beginning.
“It’s Selkie’s Culture” etc yatta yatta yatta guys it’s FIRE OUT OF HER EYEBALLS. There’s not a single culture IRL whose Thing is to SHOOT FIRE OUT OF THEIR EYEBALLS. You guys imagine your 8 year old niece suddenly developping that ability (and burning holes in her bedroom walls) and tell me with a straight face that you’ll succeed in being PC about it.
Cut the grandma some slack, it’s not like she’s been slooooowly introduced to the concept of echoes in several years (by reading 3 pages a week). How much time has passed since the girls’ ability manifested? Is it 2 months? A month? And how many times has she witnessed it herself? Every day, like the girls’ parents who enter the bedrooms to find a new burn marj on the wall?
I am probably the only one here who thinks that Grandma is entirely entitled to describe something the kids are doing that damages the house as being horrid, and that she is entitled to ask them not to do it at her house.
I trust Dave, and Todd, so I think this is going to be fine, but I do not trust people who come down Mama Bear or Papa Bear to not be being bullies using defense of their children as justification to use anger to throw their weight around. I only ever have seen entitled people doing it so for me it is highly suspect behaviour.
Professor Trenchbull enabling his son comes to mind.
I am not comfortable with Todd reacting with rage BEFORE he figures out what was being said and what was meant, especially where his mother is showing a fear reaction to him. This is not going to make Grandma less scared about what the kids are doing, but it might make her afraid of the kids themselves.
On the other hand I can easily believe that Todd has a short fuse right now from being called out for being insufficiently protective of his kids.
But she didn’t ask them not to do it at her house.
She asked them not to do it anymore – at all. Anywhere.
She called it horrid.
It sounds too much like “Go be Black somewhere else” for her not to get it
…Personally speaking, while I know grandma’s in the wrong here- and I think him being Kinda Mad ain’t anything out of his purview- but I just keep wondering how much his parents must have had to stay Really Aware of being trans-racial adoption parents. How quick any single misstep could have been used to take their kids away from them.
I think the conversation hasn’t even started; so I ain’t making any assumptions about How Bad Either Person is being here, otherwise.